Good fold or not?

[dugthefish]

subject says it all, heres a little background.

i haven't been on PS much the last few months since i pi55ed most of my BR away.  last month i found $20 was still there, so i started grinding again, playing 5/10c limit.  worked up to 10/20c and about $100 after a couple weeks.  well, i guess variance finally caught up, and i dropped back to about $40.  i was like, screw it, and sat down at a 2/5c NL table, and have been steadily moving the BR up.  im back up to over $100, but since i haven't played a lot of cash NL, i can't decide if i made the right play here.  also, this was my 3rd or 4th hand at the table, so i had no idea of how this guy plays.

Seat 1: mmcinally ($10.43 in chips)
Seat 2: ShipItNinja! ($9.65 in chips)
Seat 3: qs1205 ($3.15 in chips)
Seat 4: LJW17579 ($4.57 in chips)
Seat 5: tutis ($7 in chips)
Seat 6: dugthefish ($5.15 in chips)
Seat 7: PaleTokio ($5.61 in chips)
Seat 8: terrortrutje ($9.79 in chips)
Seat 9: Firebit ($9.70 in chips)
Firebit: posts small blind $0.02
mmcinally: posts big blind $0.05
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to dugthefish [As Ac]
ShipItNinja!: folds
qs1205: calls $0.05
LJW17579: folds
tutis: folds
dugthefish: raises $0.15 to $0.20
PaleTokio: calls $0.20
terrortrutje: folds
terrortrutje leaves the table
Firebit: calls $0.18
mmcinally: folds
qs1205: folds
*** FLOP *** [Kh Jd 2h] ($.65 in pot)
Firebit: checks
dugthefish: bets $0.50
PaleTokio: folds
kevinc255 joins the table at seat #8
Firebit: calls $0.50
*** TURN *** [Kh Jd 2h] [3c] ($1.65 in pot)
Firebit: checks
dugthefish: bets $0.90
Firebit: calls $0.90
*** RIVER *** [Kh Jd 2h 3c] [8h]
Firebit: bets $8.10 and is all-in
dugthefish: folds
Uncalled bet ($8.10) returned to Firebit
Firebit collected $3.35 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $3.50 | Rake $0.15
Board [Kh Jd 2h 3c 8h]
Seat 1: mmcinally (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 2: ShipItNinja! folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: qs1205 folded before Flop
Seat 4: LJW17579 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: tutis folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: dugthefish folded on the River
Seat 7: PaleTokio folded on the Flop
Seat 8: terrortrutje (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: Firebit (small blind) collected ($3.35)

[Martini]

That would be an expensive hero call attempt if you're wrong. Terrible bet by villain assuming he actually had a Flush since he's likely only getting called if he's beaten. He also takes away any value from you having a hand you can call with by making such an overbet. Personally I think playing shorter stacked is the way to go online if you want to build your roll. If you came in for 20 BBs instead then you can just shove the Turn and let the chips fall where they may.

[holdemholmes]

I'm with Martini on this one. This is a move i see a lot online....and a lot of the time they have the flush. It's really a dumb push by him IMO, but there's so many bad players online that i see it all the time. You only have $1.60 in the pot...pot total is at $3.45....no sense in calling more than 2x the pot size with just a pair. Good laydown in my opinion.

[troysteelerfan]

I agree with the other posts - what a horrible bet by the other player - he is only getting called by the nut flush or maybe K hi flush - I am folding AA in that situation everytime....not much else you can do....you raised at each time you had the chance to raise and just got outdrawn (maybe) - the betting history doesn't make sense as a strong hand (the flush if he hit it) should want a call and his bet certainly doesn't make it seem like he wants a call but as others have said there are so many bad players online....

[Nerre]

At that point I see nothing wrong with the fold, but if the villain was on a draw you shouldn't have let him go that far that cheap. I think your bets pre and post flop are on the low side for those stakes.

[dugthefish]

thanks for the support everybody.

I think your bets pre and post flop are on the low side for those stakes.

i more than value bet each street, and i definitley didn't give him proper odds to draw to his flush. i guess i just don't know when it is appropriate to overbet the pot; i thought i was.  what do u think a good bet size was for that hand?

online donks...what r u gonna do?

[Detroitdad]

At that point I see nothing wrong with the fold, but if the villain was on a draw you shouldn't have let him go that far that cheap. I think your bets pre and post flop are on the low side for those stakes.

I agree with Nerre.

Your bets aren't bad for a normal situation, but at a NL micro stakes cash game you have to go a little higher with your bets.

Pre flop, .20 would be fine if you were first in the post. With one caller, I'm making it .25 to .35. Being at the table for such a short time, I'm leaning towards the .35 pre flop bet.

On the Flop, I'm potting it.

On the Turn, I'm potting it again

The bad thing is, if he calls both, then your probably priced in for his shove if he gets there on the River......

[Blaster]

 I also agree w/ Nerre & DD...
  With possible flsh & straight draws, bigger flop & surely bigger turn bet was in order...
 He's calling you with "something", ... & a bigger bet may have defined his hand better or won you the pot right there ...
  If it were live or larger stakes, I'd say he's most likley on 2pr (K/J) or flopped trips ...
   A larger bet, followed by call, would have "normally" ruled out him having a flush draw, but who knows @ these stakes online ....
 Either way it's a fold ...  

[Nerre]

Always remember:

You can play right, and still lose the hand

You can play all wrong, and still win the hand

That's part of poker. Otherwise it wouldn't be poker, but bridge! :-)

[djexacto]

I also agree w/ Nerre & DD...
  With possible flsh & straight draws, bigger flop & surely bigger turn bet was in order...
 He's calling you with "something", ... & a bigger bet may have defined his hand better or won you the pot right there ...[/size]
  If it were live or larger stakes, I'd say he's most likley on 2pr (K/J) or flopped trips ...
   A larger bet, followed by call, would have "normally" ruled out him having a flush draw, but who knows @ these stakes online ....
 Either way it's a fold ...  

This would be a bad result against a draw, no?  You want him to call along all day with draws when he is priced out, so betting so much that he only calls you with a made hand is a mistake.

[luckystraights]

I also agree w/ Nerre & DD...
  With possible flsh & straight draws, bigger flop & surely bigger turn bet was in order...
 He's calling you with "something", ... & a bigger bet may have defined his hand better or won you the pot right there ...[/size]
  If it were live or larger stakes, I'd say he's most likley on 2pr (K/J) or flopped trips ...
   A larger bet, followed by call, would have "normally" ruled out him having a flush draw, but who knows @ these stakes online ....
 Either way it's a fold ...  

This would be a bad result against a draw, no?  You want him to call along all day with draws when he is priced out, so betting so much that he only calls you with a made hand is a mistake.

+1, depends a little on your hand reading ability, how likely you are to make a 2nd best hand, how likely you are to pay off, how many draws he can have, how disguised are some of his draws and all that, but generally yeah u want a call or him to make a bad fold when he's priced in.