I am having problems picking up tells

[4 of a kind]

 I have been having trouble picking up tells from my opponents. I play in a poker league and I don't always play the same people.  Sometimes there are new people that I have never seen before.

 Do you think I should be looking for betting patterns or tells? Also should I fake a few tells once in a while? Maybe the trembling hand or something else?

 I know that strong usually means weak and vice versa, but what happens when strong really is strong? How do I detect it?

[Kyle Smith]

This is an incredibly complex question.  Buy Mike Caro's Book of Tells and any other poker book you can get your hands on. 

[Detroitdad]

tells can take a long time to pick up on a person. It can be done in a few hours, but more likely, over the course of several games played with them.

As of faking tells, a lot would be determined by the skill level of your oppen's. Are they going to even recognize it?

At some point will your game be hurt because your trying a little to much "trickeration".

I rarely use tells. I have a few small tells on people. Most of the players I go against are to good though.

I mainly use betting patterns combined with the situation were in, position, chip stack sizes, what I know about the person,  what stage of the tourney (unless its cash) ect.....

B

[ChrisChip10]

Betting patterns are more important.  IMHO tells help with final table major championship tournaments against Chip Reese, Doyle Brunson, etc., etc.  If they have any anyway.

[4 of a kind]

This is an incredibly complex question.  Buy Mike Caro's Book of Tells and any other poker book you can get your hands on. 

 I read a Caro book about tells and it hard to understand as a lot of it doesn't relate to hold em.

[4 of a kind]

tells can take a long time to pick up on a person. It can be done in a few hours, but more likely, over the course of several games played with them.

As of faking tells, a lot would be determined by the skill level of your oppen's. Are they going to even recognize it?

At some point will your game be hurt because your trying a little to much "trickeration".

I rarely use tells. I have a few small tells on people. Most of the players I go against are to good though.

I mainly use betting patterns combined with the situation were in, position, chip stack sizes, what I know about the person,  what stage of the tourney (unless its cash) ect.....

B

 my oppenents skill level is nothing great. A lot of time they win by either getting the others to fold or by going all in with a big stack and no one calls them.  Even if my opponents did recognize it they wouldn't know if it was a fake or not as I have never done it before.

[Detroitdad]

I'm just saying if your playing against low skill level players (probably unattentitive as well) then pretending to have tells probably won't work. Neither will setting up an image. You might play for an hour or two setting up a tight image, but your players probably wouldn't even notice. From this little info, it is probably best to just play tight/aggressive poker.

B

[troysteelerfan]

IMO betting patterns are more important than tells.....my first thought on reading the title was a flashback to an article on read that Eli Elezra had written for a poker magazine ... it was on tournament play - and since he won't be familiar with his opponents since they are all knew to him - he typically folds almost every hand during the first few blind levels - he even mentioned that he doesn't even look at his cards...just folds and watches players....to try to pick up tells and betting patterns....this may be a possible strategy to use when you are with unfamiliar players ... I know it's very hard not to even look at your cards but perhaps you could adjust that to only playing very strong starting hands during the early levels ... the key (IMO) is to focus enough to remember to watch what the other players are doing and what cards they are showing down....

[Dr. Neau]

I have been having trouble picking up tells from my opponents.

Our next tournament is in Feb.  Let me know if you are interested.

[ryder such as]

the way i relate to your post is in the fact i play a lot of online poker. i wont pick up the same kind of tells physically, but i can notice a few things. do they check call to the river and roll over monster hands they flopped? do they play any two suited cards from middle position? how many hands are they playing? hollywood and its magic eye have led us all to believe that the greatest players in the world can peer into your soul and tell you what you had for breakfast, but in reality, the physical act of eyeballing an opposing player is just a fraction into ther "read" of you. have you played a lot of hands? do you check call to the river and fold when you miss? what types of patterns have you shown in your time at the table? case in point...some wsop event two years ago had a young kid win the whole thing. halfway thru the coverage of his final table, he limps in from the button with meager cards. two other players at the table went into hysterics because for three days running, this kid never just called from the button. he either folded or raised. and now here he is, limping for the first time on the button in 20 hours of poker, and the players convinced themselves he was slowplaying a monster, and got out of his way when he started to bet the flop. all because he broke his pattern, not because his left eye blinked slightly faster than his right, and he cracked an oreo in half and listened to it.

[TwoToGo-Grave]

Excellent post Ryder.
Also, Caro's book does have a lot that relates to hold'em, even if his examples are of other games.  It's the principles that should be taken.  However, of course, physical tells are often overrated (especially to those of us who play a lot online, I suppose).  Just play good poker and pay attention and give the situations that you see a good bit of thought and you'll get good at reads before you know it.

[NotFadeAway]

Tells are overrated as a general rule, and most good players don't give off many anyway, but they can still be useful.  I've noticed some that are very useful against bad players, namely chip loading (getting raising chips ready before their turn to act.)  Also, I've seen people who are clearly excited over a hand or card or clearly upset by one, but this doesn't take any great skill to notice.  Against any real player (someone who's not a complete donkey) betting patterns are what I mostly pay attention to, as is the case with most people here.

[demon604]

I'd suggest Read 'Em and Reap over Mike Caro's book.  It's an easier read and covers most the bases.

IMO, how you use tells is based on your opponents level of play.  I tend to use physical tells the less-experienced a player is and betting patterns the more-experienced a player is.  I'd suggest learning to pick-up tells before trying to fake them.  You need to stay on your game while picking up this information about your players in order to use this advantageously.  I do personally feel that with the influx of online poker people tend to think betting patterns are more important than physicals, but I disagree, holding all tells equal because a tell is only as good as you can apply it to a hand.

[hockeygoon]

You have to be careful with tells anyway.  Generally my brother grabs chips before it's his turn to get people to check or call a smaller bet rather than raise when he's on a draw, but sometimes he does it when he has a made hand too, just to throw people off.  He'll also wink at people, but sometimes it's when he's got nothing and sometimes it's when he has the nuts.  My sister-in-law (who thinks she's the female Phil Helmuth, with the whiny attitude to match) is the complete opposite of the typical "acts strong when she's weak and weak when she's strong" tell, which throws people who don't know her off. 

[4 of a kind]

Yesterday, when I wasn't in a pot, I was watching some of the players and I watched someone go all in for about 35,000 in chips and I noticed the shaky hand and I said to myself " that guy has a good hand" it turns out I was right as he ended up taking the pot with  trip 7's the other player who called the all in had 2 pair KK ( hole cards) and a pair of 9's on the board.

 I don't think the all in caller even noticed the shaky hand but I did and I wasn't about to say anything.

[BigFish]

I love using tells and on many occasions ive put my entire chip stack on the line on the strenth of a tell. the tells I pick up most are with the guys I play with every week. me and one other guy are about the only 2 that take poker seriously in the group and actually bothered to pick up a book (or on the subject. I tend to find Limbic tells better that the old acting tells but have picked up on both. The stongest tells ive seen are.

The good old poker cluck, Im sure you all know the one, well we have a guy that does this nearly every time he hits the flop hard so i know its time to get out the way when i hear that noise.

The passifying cheek or neck rub before making a bluff bet, I put in a big raise almost everytime I see this one.

Leaning in or sitting up after a flop... Get out this guys way

Crossing of arms and or leaning back, usually a disintrest in the hand but carefull of the guy who has his arms crossed with his thumbs sticking out thumbs is a sign of strenth.

another strong sign is the steeple where the fingers and thumbs of each hand come togerther and look almost like a church steeple.

Also a real novice mistake i see too often at our game is somone in the hand gets impatient with the talking and starts telling people its there go to act. You can be sure hes about to raise.

A great tell for women players when they have a bad hand is they will cover the little dimple at the base of there neck.

So many tells but they are some of my favs

As for faking tells i had tried this for weeks without anyone picking up until i relised the level of play is so basic i resorted to letting out a tiny grin as the flop hits just for a split seccond when im going to bluff and it works like a charm, But as i say im playing basic opponents and would never expect this to work on anyone else. : )

[Detroitdad]

I found I could pick up tells better at the Casino after only an orbit or two. With the MTPL group its much harder to pick up tells. Of course its probably back to the level of play of the opponents as well.

B

[Midnight Rose]

I love using tells and on many occasions ive put my entire chip stack on the line on the strenth of a tell. the tells I pick up most are with the guys I play with every week. me and one other guy are about the only 2 that take poker seriously in the group and actually bothered to pick up a book (or on the subject. I tend to find Limbic tells better that the old acting tells but have picked up on both. The stongest tells ive seen are.
...
A great tell for women players when they have a bad hand is they will cover the little dimple at the base of there neck.

Faygo Red Pop, everywhere.

[bubbajit]

I love using tells and on many occasions ive put my entire chip stack on the line on the strenth of a tell. the tells I pick up most are with the guys I play with every week. me and one other guy are about the only 2 that take poker seriously in the group and actually bothered to pick up a book (or on the subject. I tend to find Limbic tells better that the old acting tells but have picked up on both. The stongest tells ive seen are.
...
A great tell for women players when they have a bad hand is they will cover the little dimple at the base of there neck.

Faygo Red Pop, everywhere.

It's ok by now you must keep the towels and wet naps right beside the computer.

[Midnight Rose]

I love using tells and on many occasions ive put my entire chip stack on the line on the strenth of a tell. the tells I pick up most are with the guys I play with every week. me and one other guy are about the only 2 that take poker seriously in the group and actually bothered to pick up a book (or on the subject. I tend to find Limbic tells better that the old acting tells but have picked up on both. The stongest tells ive seen are.
...
A great tell for women players when they have a bad hand is they will cover the little dimple at the base of there neck.

Faygo Red Pop, everywhere.

It's ok by now you must keep the towels and wet naps right beside the computer.

I forgot to clean it up.  I spent all day trying to find my little dimple.

[bubbajit]

I love using tells and on many occasions ive put my entire chip stack on the line on the strenth of a tell. the tells I pick up most are with the guys I play with every week. me and one other guy are about the only 2 that take poker seriously in the group and actually bothered to pick up a book (or on the subject. I tend to find Limbic tells better that the old acting tells but have picked up on both. The stongest tells ive seen are.
...
A great tell for women players when they have a bad hand is they will cover the little dimple at the base of there neck.

Faygo Red Pop, everywhere.

It's ok by now you must keep the towels and wet naps right beside the computer.

I forgot to clean it up.  I spent all day trying to find my little dimple.

I'm sure someone you know can help you find it.