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Author Topic: a dumb check raise  (Read 371 times)
luckystraights
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« on: Nov 22, 2007 at 09:36 »

I've just a check-raise, very rare I do one, but this time I did, need to intricate them into my game more, it cost me big, just wondering if I played this bad, or whether It was just bad timing.

Here's a synopsis :

I raise from middle position with AK,  I get two callers. I miss both the ace and king on the flop and bet out half the pot, one calls, other folds. I credit my opponent for a queen and plan to check / fold, then the king comes on the turn. It seems like a great moment for a check-raise, I check, he takes the bate and bets high, I re-raise all-in, he shows KQ my king made him two pair.

I played this hand fast, and new without any doubt he had a queen, I also expected him to bet big on the turn, knowing that was my check-raise, or going all-in at least stupid here, or was it just unlucky timing on my part ?

heres the hand :

http://www.pokerhand.org/?1727424
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luckystraights
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« Reply #1 on: Nov 22, 2007 at 09:40 »

The only thing I was sure of at the time was that with my bet on the flop, neither would put me on an 8, as most of my online foes would always check with an 8 here.

Hard to say why I didn't credit my opponent for an 8 himself, it was just a feeling, you may think I'm too green to put this on experience, but thats likely what my judgment was based on.
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NotFadeAway
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« Reply #2 on: Nov 22, 2007 at 12:28 »

Raise more preflop (to about 120 or so).  However, the continuation bet looks fine, as does the check-raise on the  turn.  This is very tough, as I hate to commit my stack to a marginal hand early in a sit and go (I'd prefer to let the bad players gamble at this time, while not realizing that they are giving up large amounts of money equity), but this looks a little bit different, at least to me.  Every play you made post flop makes sense, as you can certainly put your man on a queen here (correctly), but appear to just be unlucky that he had K-Q instead of A-Q, Q-J, Q-10, etc.  Those are almost certainly easily within his range, so you certainly did not make any mistake from a chip equity position.  The money equity position is a lot closer, but I still think that you were correct to shove on him on the turn.  It's a shame that his poor play preflop was rewarded, but that happens.  After a hand like this I like to just fire up another sng and try to commit to playing well and accepting that variance is a part of the game. 
The only thing I don't like here is the tiny preflop raise, but I know that others are likely to disagree about shoving over that large turn bet (I don't really mind it, however, as you can destroy his likely range.)
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luckystraights
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« Reply #3 on: Nov 22, 2007 at 12:37 »

Well I'm pleased with your reading of the hand, glad you don't think I was a total idiot.

my raise was 3xBB, plus the call of 20. I follow Phil Gordon's advise on pre-flop raising strategy and mostly base my raises solely on position, except in rare situations such as with AA where I'm looking to trap, etc

What I would call my normal raises like this have gotten me in trouble in the past, but overall the system seems to work for me. In a loose game with monster pairs, like QQ - AA I might raise much higher pre-flop against the right opponent, knowing that he's unlikely to hold a higher pair and I'm not chasing with AK / AQ, etc.

Thanks for the feedback
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demon604
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« Reply #4 on: Nov 22, 2007 at 17:12 »

I generally agree with NFA's assessment here.  AK needs aggressive action because if you don't hit on th flop you still need to appear strong, I'd have probably doubled your pre-flop raise.  Depending on my read, I may not have called his bet on the turn but generally you didn't play this hand bad at all.
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