Too lazy to look it up, show me how smart you are

[Yankee]

Blinds are 50-100.  I am under the gun.  If I want to raise, what is the minimum can raise to?

[Squiggly]

100. Min raise = BB or size of previous raise.

[irishpenguin]

Blinds are 50-100.  I am under the gun.  If I want to raise, what is the minimum can raise to?

Depends on the situation:

Pre-flop, as UTG your minimum raise for blinds of 50-100 is 200.  100 to call the big blind.

Post-flop, minimum bet is BB (100) unless one of the blinds has bet first, than it's the amount of the previous bet/raise.

[Yankee]

That is what I thought.  I was at a public freeroll with blinds at 400-800 and UTG said he will raise to 1500.  I said you have to make it 1600 and someone else said no, he said 1500.  It was one of those times where you just say whatever as I was folding anyways.  If I was playing or raising I would have made a bigger deal about it.

[irishpenguin]

I said you have to make it 1600 and someone else said no, he said 1500.

LOL, nice...

"Yeah, I heard what he said there tough guy!"   

I'm pretty sure you're right.  The big blind is the initial bet for 800, so any raise would need to be at least 800 more for 1600.

[Yankee]

actually, not tough guy, more like old, leather faced, cancer ridden hag or something like that

[dakotakid]

If he said he was raising it 1500 as opposed to 1500(total bet) that would be ok, but it should be at least 1600 total.  The BB isn't actually the first bet, the SB is.  In theory the SB is making a bet, say 100, and then the BB is making it 200 to go and everyone after that must either call the 200, fold or raise at least an additional 200 to make it 400 to go.

[Gobbs]

In theory the SB is making a bet, say 100, and then the BB is making it 200 to go and everyone after that must either call the 200, fold or raise at least an additional 200 to make it 400 to go.

Huh?  Are you saying the Big Blind is a $100 raise of the Small Blind?  I hope not.

Gobbs

[dakotakid]

thats exactly what it is, they are forced bets though, not optional, to force action each hand.

[pathand]

Uh-oh, you've gone and done it now.         

[spade117]

thats exactly what it is, they are forced bets though, not optional, to force action each hand.

Then why is the minimum raise $200 at that point?

[austin5string]

thats exactly what it is, they are forced bets though, not optional, to force action each hand.

Then why is the minimum raise $200 at that point?

Spade-1
DK-0

[dakotakid]

That is the typical structure of texas hold'em you double the previous bet, these are arbitrary numbers for forced bets, many games don't even use blinds some use blinds with a much different structure, its really not that hard to comprehend, its like saying if one player raises 800 why does the next player have to raise 1600??   why can't he just raise 800 or 450?  or why isnt he force to raise it to 2400 or 3200??  that is the way the game is set up somewhere during the refinement of the game this is what was set up.  I know a tournament that in fact uses the SB as the minimum raise and several more that use the BB as the min raise, just the way they have theirs set up, not typical but they way they do it.  Maybe we should ask why only best 5 card hand?  there are a million things you could ask why they are done a certain way, usually because over time and trial and error way "A" is generally more preferred than way "B".

[pathand]

I tried to warn you.       

[austin5string]

That is the typical structure of texas hold'em you double the previous bet, these are arbitrary numbers for forced bets, many games don't even use blinds some use blinds with a much different structure, its really not that hard to comprehend, its like saying if one player raises 800 why does the next player have to raise 1600??   why can't he just raise 800 or 450?  or why isnt he force to raise it to 2400 or 3200??  that is the way the game is set up somewhere during the refinement of the game this is what was set up.  I know a tournament that in fact uses the SB as the minimum raise and several more that use the BB as the min raise, just the way they have theirs set up, not typical but they way they do it.  Maybe we should ask why only best 5 card hand?  there are a million things you could ask why they are done a certain way, usually because over time and trial and error way "A" is generally more preferred than way "B".

Well, mainly because it's the rules of the game, to put it simply.  But to say the big blind is a raise of the small blind is just completely wrong.

[Midnight Rose]

That is the typical structure of texas hold'em you double the previous bet, these are arbitrary numbers for forced bets, many games don't even use blinds some use blinds with a much different structure, its really not that hard to comprehend, its like saying if one player raises 800 why does the next player have to raise 1600??   why can't he just raise 800 or 450?  or why isnt he force to raise it to 2400 or 3200??  that is the way the game is set up somewhere during the refinement of the game this is what was set up.  I know a tournament that in fact uses the SB as the minimum raise and several more that use the BB as the min raise, just the way they have theirs set up, not typical but they way they do it.  Maybe we should ask why only best 5 card hand?  there are a million things you could ask why they are done a certain way, usually because over time and trial and error way "A" is generally more preferred than way "B".

Well, mainly because it's the rules of the game, to put it simply.  But to say the big blind is a raise of the small blind is just completely wrong.

His first sentence - um, the part starting with "That is the typical structure..." and ending with "...why does the next player have to raise 1600??" - isn't even accurate.  Where'd you come up with that, DK?

[dakotakid]

wow I thought you guys knew that a fairly standard rule is doble the previous bet, so that where I get 1600 if someone bets 800 you would typically have to bet at least 1600, again why not only 1200?  or 3200 thats just the way it is, but I can see you guys are in need of some serious remedial work.

[Nerre]

If it is a failry standard RULE, can you point us to somewhere it is written?

I mean, a standard rule would surely be wriiten in i a lot of places.

Maybe you mean it is "common practice"?

The point here is:

If the SB ($100) is a bet, a call would be $100. The BB is $200, thus a raise of $100.

And since any raise shall be at least the same as the last raise, UTG would then have the option to raise the same as the last raise, i.e. $100. So UTG could bet a total of $300.

But all rules say that UTG must raise at least the same amount as the BB, UTG must raise to at least $400 if he wants to raise.

So you can NOT consider the BB as a raise of the SB.

[Dr. Neau]

wow I thought you guys knew that a fairly standard rule is doble the previous bet

Never heard of it.

And stop this nonsense with the BB being a raise of the SB, because that's not what it is.

The SB is a forced partial bet (sometimes not even exactly half a bet)
The BB is a forced full bet...not a raise.

[Wedge Rock]

wow I thought you guys knew that a fairly standard rule is doble the previous bet, so that where I get 1600 if someone bets 800 you would typically have to bet at least 1600, again why not only 1200?  or 3200 thats just the way it is, but I can see you guys are in need of some serious remedial work.

Think about it:

If the SB is a bet, say 800...

And the BB is a min. raise, to say 1600...

Then UTG should be able to min raise to 2400 (the amount of the raise in front of him).  But we all know that UTG has to min. raise it to 3200...

I think that's the point Spade was making.

EDIT: Nevermind...what Nerre said.

[maryfield]

   I get way more pleasure than I should when I see someone get all snippety and self-righteous over an issue that he has got completely back-asswards.

[Nerre]

The SB is a forced partial bet (sometimes not even exactly half a bet)

Yes, I didn't even think of that part. Blinds can sometimes be for example 5/15 or even 10/10. To try to make the BB some kind of "raise" of the SB then would really mess things up.

[Gobbs]

I love it when I can simply ask a question and let somebody else stick their foot in their mouth for once.  Sorry, dk.

Gobbs

[Midnight Rose]

wow I thought you guys knew that a fairly standard rule is doble the previous bet, so that where I get 1600 if someone bets 800 you would typically have to bet at least 1600, again why not only 1200?  or 3200 thats just the way it is, but I can see you guys are in need of some serious remedial work.

I'm sorry...you were saying?


/Midnight "Last stop for the short bus!" Rose

[Dr. Neau]

wow I thought you guys knew that a fairly standard rule is doble the previous bet, so that where I get 1600 if someone bets 800 you would typically have to bet at least 1600, again why not only 1200?  or 3200 thats just the way it is, but I can see you guys are in need of some serious remedial work.

I'm sorry...you were saying?

Wow. Rose is distracted by his avatar too!

[pathand]

Avatar or not, you brought this on yourself. tsk, tsk.

[demon604]

The point here is:

If the SB ($100) is a bet, a call would be $100. The BB is $200, thus a raise of $100.

And since any raise shall be at least the same as the last raise, UTG would then have the option to raise the same as the last raise, i.e. $100. So UTG could bet a total of $300.

But all rules say that UTG must raise at least the same amount as the BB, UTG must raise to at least $400 if he wants to raise.

So you can NOT consider the BB as a raise of the SB.

Absolutely perfect explanation.

I was taught pretty much how Dr. Neau put it, that the SB is simply a half-bet, and the BB is a full bet.